Discussion:
Proposal
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Gerard Meijssen
2017-10-12 12:04:31 UTC
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Hoi,
Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource, I this
demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished books to a
reading public.

After all what is it that we do it for but for finding a public for the
transcribed books?
Thanks,
GerardM

http://ultimategerardm.blogspot.nl/2017/10/wikisource-proof-of-pudding.html
Federico Leva (Nemo)
2017-10-12 12:07:55 UTC
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Post by Gerard Meijssen
Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource, I
this demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished books to
a reading public.
In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the Wikisource
books are included in the catalogs of many libraries (also via a local
ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians to work on the "open
collection", big kudos to them).

Nemo
Sam Walton
2017-10-12 12:37:59 UTC
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Hi all,

I work on the Wikipedia Library program, and wanted to jump in with a
passing thought I'd had about Wikisource and TWL. We'll be building search
and discovery tools into the library card platform (
https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/) that's currently under ongoing
development. They'll index all the usually-paywalled resources we have
access to, but also open access content. As part of that process it's a
desire of mine to index completed Wikisource works, though I haven't given
it much thought beyond 'that would be nice'. This might be able to function
as a kind of centralised search for all completed Wikisource works, if
implemented.

If you're interested, the relevant Phab task is https://phabricator.
wikimedia.org/T169875, where your thoughts are very welcome. It won't be
worked on for a while and I can't guarantee that it will definitely happen,
but if it's something the Wikisource community would benefit from, then
that would absolutely increase the likelihood we'll work on it.

Best,
Sam
Post by Federico Leva (Nemo)
Post by Gerard Meijssen
Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource, I
this demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished books to a
reading public.
In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the Wikisource
books are included in the catalogs of many libraries (also via a local
ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians to work on the "open
collection", big kudos to them).
Nemo
_______________________________________________
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
--
Sam Walton
Partnerships Coordinator
The Wikipedia Library

***@wikipedialibrary.org / ***@wikimedia.org
Gerard Meijssen
2017-10-12 12:49:27 UTC
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Hoi,
In my opinion this is a service not only for editors but for the complete
Wikimedia reader public. So the notion of putting it in that platform is
great but we need to advertise the finished books of Wikisource to the
whole world.
Thanks,
GerardM
Post by Sam Walton
Hi all,
I work on the Wikipedia Library program, and wanted to jump in with a
passing thought I'd had about Wikisource and TWL. We'll be building search
and discovery tools into the library card platform (
https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/) that's currently under ongoing
development. They'll index all the usually-paywalled resources we have
access to, but also open access content. As part of that process it's a
desire of mine to index completed Wikisource works, though I haven't given
it much thought beyond 'that would be nice'. This might be able to function
as a kind of centralised search for all completed Wikisource works, if
implemented.
If you're interested, the relevant Phab task is
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T169875, where your thoughts are very
welcome. It won't be worked on for a while and I can't guarantee that it
will definitely happen, but if it's something the Wikisource community
would benefit from, then that would absolutely increase the likelihood
we'll work on it.
Best,
Sam
Post by Federico Leva (Nemo)
Post by Gerard Meijssen
Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource, I
this demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished books to a
reading public.
In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the Wikisource
books are included in the catalogs of many libraries (also via a local
ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians to work on the "open
collection", big kudos to them).
Nemo
_______________________________________________
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
--
Sam Walton
Partnerships Coordinator
The Wikipedia Library
_______________________________________________
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Sam Wilson
2017-10-12 12:51:46 UTC
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It's slightly tricky at the moment to extract data for validated works,
for one because we don't have solid data linking Index pages to their
corresponding main namespace (i.e. "work") pages. The Index pages have
the status, but the mainspace pages are what we think of as the work.
There's P1957 now, which is the connextion we need, but the data for
that isn't complete.
We've also got (incomplete) support for OPDS in the wsexport tool, which
I think is probably a brilliant way forward for sharing the Wikisource
catalogue with other systems. Once we have better structural support in
Wikisource itself (e.g. structured data for querying validation status)
then we'll much more efficiently and easily be able to produce all sorts
of output for sharing.
Post by Sam Walton
Hi all,
I work on the Wikipedia Library program, and wanted to jump in with a
passing thought I'd had about Wikisource and TWL. We'll be building
search and discovery tools into the library card platform
(https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/) that's currently under ongoing
development. They'll index all the usually-paywalled resources we have
access to, but also open access content. As part of that process it's
a desire of mine to index completed Wikisource works, though I haven't
given it much thought beyond 'that would be nice'. This might be able
to function as a kind of centralised search for all completed
Wikisource works, if implemented.>
If you're interested, the relevant Phab task is
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T169875, where your thoughts are
very welcome. It won't be worked on for a while and I can't guarantee
that it will definitely happen, but if it's something the Wikisource
community would benefit from, then that would absolutely increase the
likelihood we'll work on it.>
Best,
Sam
On 12 October 2017 at 13:07, Federico Leva (Nemo)
Post by Federico Leva (Nemo)
Post by Gerard Meijssen
Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource,
I this demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished
books to a reading public.>>
In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the
Wikisource books are included in the catalogs of many libraries (also
via a local ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians to work
on the "open collection", big kudos to them).>>
Nemo
_______________________________________________
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
--
Sam Walton
Partnerships Coordinator
The Wikipedia Library
_________________________________________________
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Sam Wilson
2017-10-12 13:05:29 UTC
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Sorry, Sam, the other thing I meant to say was: that's a brilliant idea!
:-) I'd love to help make it happen, if I can be of any use. :)
Post by Sam Wilson
It's slightly tricky at the moment to extract data for validated
works, for one because we don't have solid data linking Index pages to
their corresponding main namespace (i.e. "work") pages. The Index
pages have the status, but the mainspace pages are what we think of as
the work. There's P1957 now, which is the connextion we need, but the
data for that isn't complete.>
We've also got (incomplete) support for OPDS in the wsexport tool,
which I think is probably a brilliant way forward for sharing the
Wikisource catalogue with other systems. Once we have better
structural support in Wikisource itself (e.g. structured data for
querying validation status) then we'll much more efficiently and
easily be able to produce all sorts of output for sharing.>
Post by Sam Walton
Hi all,
I work on the Wikipedia Library program, and wanted to jump in with a
passing thought I'd had about Wikisource and TWL. We'll be building
search and discovery tools into the library card platform
(https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/) that's currently under
ongoing development. They'll index all the usually-paywalled
resources we have access to, but also open access content. As part of
that process it's a desire of mine to index completed Wikisource
works, though I haven't given it much thought beyond 'that would be
nice'. This might be able to function as a kind of centralised search
for all completed Wikisource works, if implemented.>>
If you're interested, the relevant Phab task is
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T169875, where your thoughts are
very welcome. It won't be worked on for a while and I can't guarantee
that it will definitely happen, but if it's something the Wikisource
community would benefit from, then that would absolutely increase the
likelihood we'll work on it.>>
Best,
Sam
On 12 October 2017 at 13:07, Federico Leva (Nemo)
Post by Federico Leva (Nemo)
Post by Gerard Meijssen
Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource,
I this demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished
books to a reading public.>>>
In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the
Wikisource books are included in the catalogs of many libraries
(also via a local ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians
to work on the "open collection", big kudos to them).>>>
Nemo
_______________________________________________
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
--
Sam Walton
Partnerships Coordinator
The Wikipedia Library
_________________________________________________
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
_________________________________________________
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
Andrea Zanni
2017-10-12 13:29:47 UTC
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This is an ooooooold issue: Wikisource does not have proper metadata.

I'm one of the people that Nemo Was mentioning: I'm a digital librarian
working for MLOL, and in the past 2 years, among other dozens of digital
libraries, I've managed to import Wikisource metadata on MLOL in 3
languages (English, French, Italian):
http://openmlol.it/Media/Search?Publisher=620

It has been a pain in the ass because I actually had to web scrape the
websites, from lists derived from categories. There is no easy way to have
metadata about Wikisource books, at the moment.

There are prototypes like WS-search, from Sam Wilson:
http://tools.wmflabs.org/ws-search/

And I'm sure that Tpt has some scripts to parse Wikisource (also, there was
OPDS).

The Wikisource community tried somewhat to solve the issue via Wikidata,
but discovered another black hole: modelling books on Wikidata it's very
tricky, and even after 2 Wikicite conferences (with Tpt and other
Wikisource people) I must confess I'm still confused...
For personal reasons I've not worked on the matter in the last months,
hopefully, will do in the near future.

I remember Vigneron was braver than me and recently tried to revive the
discussion:
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata_talk:WikiProject_Books

IF (and it's a big IF) we find a workable solution with Wikidata
(theoretical and practical) and
IF (and it's a big IF) we find some skilled Wikidata people to help us with
customised queries and bots to help with the transition (we need to import
Wikisource data into Wikidata, and we need to clear existing Wikidata items
following the standard model, and we need to maintain them in the future),
then it's doable and we have solved the metadata problem.

Unfortunately, I spent most of my adult and professional life complaining
about this (also, I really tried),
and nothing really changed... ;-)

Aubrey
Post by Sam Wilson
Sorry, Sam, the other thing I meant to say was: that's a brilliant idea!
:-) I'd love to help make it happen, if I can be of any use. :)
It's slightly tricky at the moment to extract data for validated works,
for one because we don't have solid data linking Index pages to their
corresponding main namespace (i.e. "work") pages. The Index pages have the
status, but the mainspace pages are what we think of as the work. There's
P1957 now, which is the connextion we need, but the data for that isn't
complete.
We've also got (incomplete) support for OPDS in the wsexport tool, which I
think is probably a brilliant way forward for sharing the Wikisource
catalogue with other systems. Once we have better structural support in
Wikisource itself (e.g. structured data for querying validation status)
then we'll much more efficiently and easily be able to produce all sorts of
output for sharing.
Hi all,
I work on the Wikipedia Library program, and wanted to jump in with a
passing thought I'd had about Wikisource and TWL. We'll be building search
and discovery tools into the library card platform (
https://wikipedialibrary.wmflabs.org/) that's currently under ongoing
development. They'll index all the usually-paywalled resources we have
access to, but also open access content. As part of that process it's a
desire of mine to index completed Wikisource works, though I haven't given
it much thought beyond 'that would be nice'. This might be able to function
as a kind of centralised search for all completed Wikisource works, if
implemented.
If you're interested, the relevant Phab task is
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T169875, where your thoughts are very
welcome. It won't be worked on for a while and I can't guarantee that it
will definitely happen, but if it's something the Wikisource community
would benefit from, then that would absolutely increase the likelihood
we'll work on it.
Best,
Sam
Given the discussion about finished books on the Korean Wikisource, I this
demonstrates that we really need to advertise the finished books to a
reading public.
In Italy, after many years of talk with local libraries, the Wikisource
books are included in the catalogs of many libraries (also via a local
ebook provider, MLOL, who hired some wikimedians to work on the "open
collection", big kudos to them).
Nemo
_______________________________________________
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
--
Sam Walton
Partnerships Coordinator
The Wikipedia Library
*_______________________________________________*
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
*_______________________________________________*
Wikisource-l mailing list
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikisource-l
_______________________________________________
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